Claude Lanzmann Shoah Collection, Interview with Jan Karski (part 3)

- Who asked you to visit the Warsaw Ghetto? Who organized?

- Be able to say, I saw it myself. They are this way. Apparently, he knew English. This will be good. We can organize for you to visit the Jewish ghetto. Without great difficulties, we can organize for you to visit Jewish camp in Bełżec.

- Extermination camp.

- Yes. Now, he says 'I don't think that you will run into some extraordinary risk. But of course, you' I say No. 'Would you do it? If you do to the Jewish ghetto in Warsaw, I will go with you. I will be sure that you will be as safe as possible. To Belżec, we have good contacts. Will you do it?' I said I will do it. Well, a few days later, we established contact. He told me 'Well, of course, no fancy dresses and we don't grave before we have to look as much as possible as they look over there. It will be very unpleasant for your experience, but it will be useful'. So now it was very easy. No accident of whatever nature. By that time, by the way, Jewish ghetto as it existed in 1942 until July did not exist anymore. Out of approximately 400,000 Jews, in the meantime, some 300,000 were already deported from the ghetto. Within the outside walls, practically, there were some four units. The most important was the so-called the Central Ghetto. They were separated by some areas inhabited by the areas already, some areas not inhabited by anybody. The story was there was some building.

This building was constructed in such a way, that the wall which separated the ghetto from the outside world, the back of the building, it was a part of that wall. The front was facing the alien area. Very simply, there was some cellar with some tunnel, and they were smuggling food whatsoever, Jews coming out. We went through this tunnel without any difficulties. I was not disguised. He was not disguised. What struck me, completely different man.

- The Bund leader?

- The Bund leader.

- The Polish novelman?

- The Polish novelman. Fantastic. I go with him. He is broken down, curbing, little Jew. Different person, completely.

- He looked suddenly like...

- Like a Jew, like a Jew from the ghetto, as if he lived there all the time. Apparently, this was his nature. This was his world.

But excuse me, did he wear the David Stern on, you too?

- Did what?

- Did he wear the David Stern?

- Oh, yes.

- You too?

- I too.

- Only children did not wear it.

- Yes, but you had to wear it.

- Sure. Some movement starts. Jews are running from the street I was on. Bund leader 'follow me, follow me'.

Now, apparently, he understood what was taking place. Follow me, follow me. Good luck, good luck. I never saw him again.

- Can you describe the meeting? How long it lasted? How did you see them?

- Now I go back.